We speak with retired FBI agent Wayne Barnes about his career in counterintelligence, from undercover work with the Black Panthers and a hidden Nixon assassination plot to debriefing Cold War defectors and recruiting Soviet intelligence officers. We also dig into his book A Traitor in the FBI, the hunt for a Russian mole inside the Bureau, and the tradecraft, deception, and lucky breaks that shaped the case.
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"Karl Casey @ White Bat Audio"
00:00 — Start
01:16 — Debriefing Cold War Defectors
02:28 — Wayne Barnes’ Origin Story
07:13 — Penn State, Villanova, and the Road to the FBI
14:08 — Early FBI Career Before Quantico
17:39 — The Undercover Black Panther Operation
26:38 — The Compton Vetting Test
29:52 — Bill Cosby, Backstopping, and the Cover Story
31:23 — George H.W. Bush and the UN Recognition Play
35:59 — The Hidden Nixon Assassination Plot
39:22 — Debriefing Defectors and the CIA-FBI Divide
42:49 — Ion Pacepa and the Romanian Intelligence Collapse
45:33 — Courtship: CIA and FBI Working Together
48:08 — Country Music, Cover Legends, and Recruiting Soviets
53:06 — The FBI Mole Hunt Begins
59:21 — The Mission: Get a Russian to Identify the Mole
01:04:25 — Robert Hanssen, Breach, and What the Movie Missed
01:07:03 — Setting the Stage at the Santa Monica Film Festival
01:11:17 — Hollywood Help, Polly Platt, and Backstopping Ivan
01:20:03 — Staging the First Visual Contact
01:25:43 — Who “Ivan” Was and Why He Mattered
01:28:58 — The Poolside Setup That Made Contact Possible
01:35:35 — Why Cold Pitches Don’t Work
01:42:24 — What Happened After Ivan Pointed Out the Photo
01:48:38 — Brian Kelley, False Leads, and Dead Drop Maps
01:52:52 — Why the Case Almost Disappeared
01:58:23 — Robert Redford, Three Days of the Condor, and Real-World Fallout
02:06:37 — What Spy Movies Get Wrong
02:09:01 — A Traitor in the FBI and Final Thoughts
